Binder Bench

Go Back   Binder Bench > Main Tech Forums > Scout 80/800
Home Register PhotoPost FORUMS CHATROOM FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 11-29-2005
Jensers's Avatar
Jensers Jensers is offline
Webmaster
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Royal City, Washington
Posts: 5,642
REBUILDING an 80/800 Door & Seals

Ronnie -

I would really like to see this topic covered in detail and added as a FAQ because I know that A LOT of people are trying to sort out the best way to rebuild their 80/800 doors, window regulators, and Seals.

Hopfully doing all this without loosing their shirts - so to speak.

I think that the current kits out there for doing this are overpriced and it makes me angry. I know we can put our heads together and figure out how to do this cheaply, cleanly, and easially.

What do you got Ronnie?
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 11-29-2005
MBF80 MBF80 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Tyler, TX
Posts: 259
Re: REBUILDING an 80/800 Door & Seals

I agree. Although it is way down my list, I would really like to see a discussion on this topic for future refrence. My 80's doors need a lot of work.

Matt F.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 11-30-2005
kneemoe kneemoe is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Upstate New York
Posts: 416
Re: REBUILDING an 80/800 Door & Seals

wow, read my mind ...
went outside last night to roll up the windows for the front moving thru....
driver's side windows regulator decided it didn't like me and seperated itself from the window.... now i get to go searching through endless posts to figure it all out :)
oh well, such is the life of a scout (80) owner
__________________
Dan Wolfe
Don't ever sell your Scout unless you've got another, you will regret it.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 11-30-2005
lonnie lonnie is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: oregon city, oregon
Posts: 907
Re: REBUILDING an 80/800 Door & Seals

me tooooooo...

i am right in the middle of rebuilding my model 80 doors(sliders). have them stripped. spent part of last sunday drilling out bolts (yes all of them) which hold hinges. went thru 5 drill bits. have a fiar amout of repair to do, fixing botched repairs and the normal rust.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 12-01-2005
pondscum pondscum is offline
Lithopedion
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: maryland
Posts: 398
Re: REBUILDING an 80/800 Door & Seals

This is a fantastic idea, furthermore it should be organized at some point into a 'how to' this or that, with detailed information and references to available part numbers/crosses. Window tracks for both the roll ups and sliders are insanely overpriced. I read somewhere recently that a piece of vinyl siding trim can be cut in a particular way to mimic the plastic rollup window slip track...thats the info we in the 80/800 world really need. Also a place to post needs and a surplus parts bank for trading, maybe a sticky thread in this forum.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 12-02-2005
Ronnie's Avatar
Ronnie Ronnie is offline
80/800 Forum Mod
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Phoenix AZ
Posts: 1,982
Re: REBUILDING an 80/800 Door & Seals

I think it's a great idea....if we can get all the relevant info into one place, then we can make a FAQ or just make this thread into the FAQ...it's stuff we all need to know!! : thumbsup

Ronnie : kewl :
__________________
Bluejay
Lil Red Bus
1967 800
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 12-02-2005
Don Bellamy's Avatar
Don Bellamy Don Bellamy is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Victoria B.C. Canada
Posts: 77
Re: REBUILDING an 80/800 Door & Seals

I've now gone 14 years without windows (sliders) & have tried to repiar what I have to no success. My frames have been welded a couple of times now & are Junk.I have been thinking of makeing soft windows for years kinda like what you may see on a boat but would prefer a stock working window.
I'm looking forward to this thread : thumbsup
__________________
Island Scout 80
1961 80 152-4 d27f&r
1961 Cub Cadet Original
1971 Cub 147
1974 Cub 109
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 12-02-2005
Jensers's Avatar
Jensers Jensers is offline
Webmaster
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Royal City, Washington
Posts: 5,642
Re: REBUILDING an 80/800 Door & Seals

Uh oh - it looks like we are all thinking that it would be great to know - but nobody knows!

I have a set of doors that I need to do so I will take some pics and see if we cant get the ball rolling.

I know that rick has rebuilt a few doors - He will have some insight on this... I will try to get him to speak up.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 12-04-2005
TDemarco TDemarco is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Petaluma, CA
Posts: 314
Send a message via AIM to TDemarco
Re: REBUILDING an 80/800 Door & Seals

i have a pretty big gap between my door and the top of the scout. i dont really want to pay for a weatherstripping kit? any ideas? i was thinking i might just have to go to Yardbirds or some home improvement store and buy some of that weatherstripping used to fill gaps in windows. the stuff with the glue on one side. not very prudy but hopefully it will keep the water out during the rainy season, besides i think its around 15$ for 10 ft.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 12-04-2005
pondscum pondscum is offline
Lithopedion
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: maryland
Posts: 398
Re: REBUILDING an 80/800 Door & Seals

Don...I am working on a frame for the window opening that duplicates the shape of the stock window as it comes in contact with the top and windshield frame. You have to be able to open and close the door, unless you weld the doors in ala General Lee!!! It looks just like a rolled-up window (frame) except that it is welded to a flange/plate at the top of the door, sealing off the door innards from the elements. The window canvas w/light snaps to this frame and flange. I am working on the proper tilt-in angle of the window. My first attempt was about 2 degrees off resulting in a poor seal at the top and air was wistling around the windshield. Might have to make shims for racked body tubs or tops, as every top I have ever worked with has been a little off relative to the body. On my prototype, it was just inadequate measurement!
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 12-05-2005
Jensers's Avatar
Jensers Jensers is offline
Webmaster
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Royal City, Washington
Posts: 5,642
Re: REBUILDING an 80/800 Door & Seals

Cool - Got any pics?
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 12-05-2005
Jensers's Avatar
Jensers Jensers is offline
Webmaster
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Royal City, Washington
Posts: 5,642
Re: REBUILDING an 80/800 Door & Seals

Ok - so lets start by looking at the door itself. As far as guides/seals go just for the door, I see the following:

Front guide - a u-shaped piece that allows the window to slide smootly.

Rear guide - Same as front only wider.

Window Holders - I dont know what these are called, but it is the pieces that go on either side of the window, sandwitching it to keep the window from rattling around, and also to seal the door so water/things dont drop down in.

Vent Rubber - The rubber around the vent windows - Seems impossible to replace... Hopefully yours is good.

I am going to look thru JC Whitney, and go kick around the junkyard, but while I am doing that, does anyone have any specific ideas about good replacements for these parts?
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	doorguide1.jpg
Views:	669
Size:	82.0 KB
ID:	2487   Click image for larger version

Name:	wing1.jpg
Views:	613
Size:	66.9 KB
ID:	2488   Click image for larger version

Name:	rearguide1.jpg
Views:	606
Size:	68.6 KB
ID:	2489  
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 12-05-2005
pondscum pondscum is offline
Lithopedion
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: maryland
Posts: 398
Re: REBUILDING an 80/800 Door & Seals

Right now my dig camera will work for me at home where it is useless but won't once I go through the front door. It keeps saying 'lens cover closed' when it is actually open, which means there is a fault in the light meter. Therefore, I have no pics right now but I will soon.

A description...

Think of the outline of the vent and rolled up window as one big panel. The frame is 1/2" X 3/4" stock bent and welded into a hoop and is welded to a plate that covers the window slot in the top of the door. The plate is broke to the shape of the inner and outer door contours. Two strips are welded to the underside to keep this slot spread open. The inner felt strip mount that screws to the top of the door on the inside is replaced by a flange that is attached to this plate. It is the most important means of attachment at this point, but I think it would work best to replace the sliders as there are tabs spot welded down in the door that the slider window tracks are bolted to. If you have never seen the slider setup this description will mean nothing to you. Anyway, all of the snaps are mounted to this hoop and plate so that you do not have to drill holes in your door. You eliminate vent windows...no leaks or whistling...and you have a big open window with the canvas/light down. I don't have all of the bugs out but it actually is more weathertight than my rollups.

When I get the damn camera working again, I'll post or send some pics. If I can get it working before I get into plowing, I'll post some pics of the hinged FG tonneau cover I made for 80/800 cabtop pickups.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 12-05-2005
Jensers's Avatar
Jensers Jensers is offline
Webmaster
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Royal City, Washington
Posts: 5,642
Re: REBUILDING an 80/800 Door & Seals

Cool - Soft half doors for people with sliders. This is what I origionally had planned. I am excited to see how it all looks.

We should split this thread. One for Soft windows, and one for roll up rebuild.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 12-05-2005
pondscum pondscum is offline
Lithopedion
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: maryland
Posts: 398
Re: REBUILDING an 80/800 Door & Seals

Not just for sliders...also for folks frustrated with their crappy rollups and bad vent windows...just throw them away. No felts, plastic tracks, regulators, handles, vent seals.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 12-08-2005
rlireland's Avatar
rlireland rlireland is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Tucson, AZ
Posts: 162
Re: REBUILDING an 80/800 Door & Seals

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jensers
Ok - so lets start by looking at the door itself. As far as guides/seals go just for the door, I see the following:

Front guide - a u-shaped piece that allows the window to slide smootly.

Rear guide - Same as front only wider.
Check this link for a description of what I did on my 800A windows. Scroll down to the August 22, 2004 entry. There are photos and part numbers.
Quote:
Window Holders - I dont know what these are called, but it is the pieces that go on either side of the window, sandwitching it to keep the window from rattling around, and also to seal the door so water/things dont drop down in.
These are called "felts" or "anti-rattle strips". There is also information on what I used at the link above.

Roy
__________________
1970 800A SR-2 V304/T-39/D30-D44 3.73/31's
1971 800B Comanche V304/T-39/D30-D44 3.73/31's
1971 800B 196/T-18/D30-D44 4.27/31's/PTO winch
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 12-08-2005
Mark Ashford's Avatar
Mark Ashford Mark Ashford is offline
Web Wheeler :(
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Woodinville, WA.
Posts: 563
Re: REBUILDING an 80/800 Door & Seals

Hey Don, just as an FYI, I might have a set of slider window for you... my (wife's) new 80 has them but they will me roll-ups when I'm done.

Projects a little ways off (summer?), but if your intrested, I'm sur we can work something out.

-mark
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 12-09-2005
Jensers's Avatar
Jensers Jensers is offline
Webmaster
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Royal City, Washington
Posts: 5,642
Re: REBUILDING an 80/800 Door & Seals

I went and found your information on the stuff that you used for your anti-rattle strips/felt/wipers. Here is what I found.

Quote:
August 22, 2004
... I installed new window "felts" (anti-rattle strips) from Anything Scout. The strips are not exact replacements for the Scout 80/800. They are rubber "wipers" on both sides and have no chrome bead like the originals.
No big deal but the bigger issue was that the holes for the mounting clips are not in the same locations as the original. This was not going to be a quick, snap out-snap in replacement. I decided to mark the new locations and drill holes for some #8 self tapping sheet metal screws.
This kind of bothers me because they are being advertised as replacements, and the site you share next has proven the fact to me that the kit is more of a collection of 'Universal' items that can be had at a more reasonable price.

Quote:
On the inside, I used some window belt weatherstrip from Restoration Specialties (P/N M113) which is a close replacement for the original. Those pieces are attached with wire staples and require some drilling and tedious replacement of the new staples to get them installed. A quicker way would be to use 1/8" pop rivets which would be buried deep enough in the fuzzy pile and not scrape against the window.
I went and checked out this website. THIS IS A REALLY COOL WEBSITE. All old IH truck fans need to go to this site and get this catalog because they have a bunch of stuff for KB and 50's IH trucks that I have never seen anywhere before.

Anyway - The felt you are talking about is supposed to be for 62-64 Chevy - But this doesnt really matter. It is a Universal thing -
You get 96" of the stuff for $27 bucks. 96" is 8' - Probably enough to do 3 sets of doors give or take. $9 bucks a rig - Not too bad.


Quote:
The rear edge window guides were replaced with felt window channel from Restoration Specialties (P/N 10-E-60). I got everything in but the window still doesn't work perfectly. I still have to pull it by hand to get it to roll all the way up. And going down, it seems to hit something that keeps it from lowering smoothly. I have to let it fall hard against the resistance to make it go down past whatever the restriction is. Oh well. At least I got the felts put in so the window doesn't rattle anymore. It makes a big difference when driving on rough roads, even around town.
Their catalog is jammed full of all kinds of channel, rubber strips, weather stripping, window felts, etc. All of this includes measurements so you know what you are ordering and if it is adaptable to your project.

I am going to spend some time looking thru the catalog to find some good options. Thanks for the heads up on this!

http://www.restorationspecialties.com
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 12-09-2005
Don Bellamy's Avatar
Don Bellamy Don Bellamy is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Victoria B.C. Canada
Posts: 77
Re: REBUILDING an 80/800 Door & Seals

Mark, I'm very int in those sliding frames
you can Email or PM me any time
I have all my glass & the part that fits in the door
I can take pics if anyone wants to see what I've got
__________________
Island Scout 80
1961 80 152-4 d27f&r
1961 Cub Cadet Original
1971 Cub 147
1974 Cub 109
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 12-09-2005
rlireland's Avatar
rlireland rlireland is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Tucson, AZ
Posts: 162
Re: REBUILDING an 80/800 Door & Seals

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jensers
I went and checked out this website. THIS IS A REALLY COOL WEBSITE. All old IH truck fans need to go to this site and get this catalog because they have a bunch of stuff for KB and 50's IH trucks that I have never seen anywhere before.
Their catalog is jammed full of all kinds of channel, rubber strips, weather stripping, window felts, etc. All of this includes measurements so you know what you are ordering and if it is adaptable to your project.
I am going to spend some time looking thru the catalog to find some good options. Thanks for the heads up on this!

http://www.restorationspecialties.com
Another good source of rubber seal and weatherstrip material is Metro Moulded Products: https://secure.metrommp.com/index1.htm
They also have a catalog with drawings and measurements.

Roy
__________________
1970 800A SR-2 V304/T-39/D30-D44 3.73/31's
1971 800B Comanche V304/T-39/D30-D44 3.73/31's
1971 800B 196/T-18/D30-D44 4.27/31's/PTO winch
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 12-09-2005
walker walker is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: AZ
Posts: 110
Re: REBUILDING an 80/800 Door & Seals

Hardest thing to find is that tee shaped extruded piece of plastic for the front metal edge of the roll up windows. I have seen the dealers selling them for upwards of $75. Too expensive for me. If anyone has found a workaround for this, I would love to hear it.
__________________
Walker
'67 scout 800
'67 Chevy C-10
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 12-13-2005
nick rayer nick rayer is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: dexter, michigan
Posts: 59
Re: REBUILDING an 80/800 Door & Seals

A cheap and easy fix for the front "T" shaped window guide on the roll ups is off a scout II. The 80/800s used a guide that slid in the vent window and the door glass slid up and down in it ,while the guide was stationary. Fix is to pull the front guide off a scout II. Trim off what isn't needed with a sharp knife. Drill and tap the window frame and attach your modified guide to the framesing the tiny screws you saved off the scout II. Reassemble the window. Works like a charm. The only difference is the guide now moves with the window. Not stock, but perfect for a driver and is damn near free.

Nick
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 01-09-2006
Jensers's Avatar
Jensers Jensers is offline
Webmaster
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Royal City, Washington
Posts: 5,642
Re: REBUILDING an 80/800 Door & Seals

Pondscum - Any Pics Yet of the soft half-doors?!?
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 01-09-2006
Jensers's Avatar
Jensers Jensers is offline
Webmaster
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Royal City, Washington
Posts: 5,642
Re: REBUILDING an 80/800 Door & Seals

This was sent to me by rdgower:

I was resourcing for this topic on the BB when I ran across your thread. Dave at Restoration Specialties now has a direct manufacturer's replacement part for the 800 Belt Weatherstrip sets. Someone (you?) sent him an original set within the last two weeks and he replicated. I've ordered a set ($45.00 for a set of four...2-exterior rubber belts; 2-interior felt belts). I'll let you know how they work. You can post this if you'd like.


COOL!
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 01-18-2006
rdgower's Avatar
rdgower rdgower is offline
Hey Chief
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 12
Re: REBUILDING an 80/800 Door & Seals

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jensers
This was sent to me by rdgower:

I was resourcing for this topic on the BB when I ran across your thread. Dave at Restoration Specialties now has a direct manufacturer's replacement part for the 800 Belt Weatherstrip sets. Someone (you?) sent him an original set within the last two weeks and he replicated. I've ordered a set ($45.00 for a set of four...2-exterior rubber belts; 2-interior felt belts). I'll let you know how they work. You can post this if you'd like.


COOL!
The belt weatherstrips (outside rubber) and felts came in and were exact replacements as advertised. I finished the installation tonight and I'm happy with it. I also found replacement door seals from McMaster-Carr, so should be able to keep some heat in.

As others have observed, originally the felts were attached to the inside trim cap with staples. Dave included staples with the felts and suggested marking the location of the old staple holes on the new felts then drilling them out and hand-crimping the new felts on. Seemed like that was going to be tough to do, so I called around looking for a body shop with one of the staplers. No luck, but did find a restorer who said they use 1/8" alum pop rivets then further brad the back side with vice-grips so they will clear the door. Tried it and distorted the felt. I ended up trimming them w/a Dremmel & cut-off wheel...left just enough of the crimp to hold, it worked great.

The belt weatherstrips have the same clips as the originals and aligned with the slots perfectly. Took a couple of tries to perfect my technique, but a dead-blow, blunt flat blade screwdriver, and a little patience rendered success.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Belt weatherstrip & felts 002.jpg
Views:	830
Size:	65.8 KB
ID:	2763   Click image for larger version

Name:	Belt weatherstrip & felts 006.jpg
Views:	935
Size:	96.1 KB
ID:	2764   Click image for larger version

Name:	Belt weatherstrip & felts 008.jpg
Views:	977
Size:	100.0 KB
ID:	2765  
__________________
'71 800B 258 4-Speed
Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 09:44 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Powered by vBulletin Copyright 2000-2006 Jelsoft Enterprises Limited.