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  • Holly Pro Injection

    Fat Boys wants to install this on my truck and teach me how to use it. Cost: 0

    So I saw Jim Weed's write up on boaring the 2bbl manafold and it looks like I am ready to go with this.

    Anything I should know? thoughts? Will the HEI Dizzy still work?

  • #2
    Re: Holly Pro Injection

    [Originally posted by n2ihc
    Fat Boys wants to install this on my truck and teach me how to use it. Cost: 0

    -Not sure who the fat boys are but anything free is good!!

    So I saw Jim Weed's write up on boaring the 2bbl manafold and it looks like I am ready to go with this.


    -You can read some of the post here for ideas that others are doing or do it the way Jim did it. Up to you.

    Anything I should know? thoughts? Will the HEI Dizzy still work?
    -Yes the dist conversion will still work. Just leave the vacuum and mech advance intact since the holley has no control over advance.

    -You should still go with the closed loop option. (O2 sensor)
    Last edited by Bill usn-1; 01-26-2003, 08:13 PM.
    Bill USN-1

    COMMITED TO TEACHING PEOPLE THE "PROPER" WAY TO EFI
    HAMILTON FUEL INJECTION
    May be the answer to all your fuel injection needs!
    Learn to do it right.

    Comment


    • #3
      Jim Weeds web site has been an inspiration for IH enthusiasts for years. The problem is, it has not been updated in years. The article you are referring to was written by Mike Deschamps and on his web site says that the JB Weld part is obsolete do to breakage. His new method is to use an aluminum adapter. But you can still bore the manifold and adapter.

      Read this whole page before you start it is a little confusing because it starts with the JB Weld and then changes to the adapter.

      http://edge.edge.net/~deschamp/tbitech.html

      That web site is down last I checked hope we didn't lose more information. I do have the plans saved if we need them.
      [CENTER]1994 Buick RoadMaSSter Estate Wagon LT1/4L60E. White and Woodgrain Sleeper...PCM 16188051 With SS/V4P/Custom Tune! WOT 12.9 AFR!

      1990 Chevy Suburban Silverado 5.7L 2wd ECM 1227747 HiWay Lean Cruise 18.5 MPG and 12.5 to 1 AFR at WOT!

      1972 IH 1210 Isky Cammed Balenced 345 4 speed PCM 16197427 Project!

      [SIZE=3][B][URL="http://www.gearhead-efi.com/"]GearHead-EFI.com[/URL] EFI Conversions and Chip Tuners![/B][/SIZE]
      [B]May be all you need to know about EFI![/B]

      and I still help local JustIH members (for fun) free! :cool: [/CENTER]

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Re: Holly Pro Injection

        [QUOTE]Originally posted by Bill usn-1
        Just leave the vacuum and mech advance intact since the holley has no control over advance.

        Bill,

        I have a Holley Projection 4DI that does have a spark maping capability, with instructions for connecting to a GM 7-wire distributor or, with an adapter, to a Ford 'non-signature' TBI distributor(?).

        I am running a points distributor, with a Pertronix trigger, now. I am open to suggestions on what I should convert to so that I can take advantage of the Holley ECM spark control capability, GM? Ford? or?

        Mickey

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Re: Re: Holly Pro Injection

          [QUOTE]Originally posted by littledog1
          Originally posted by Bill usn-1
          Just leave the vacuum and mech advance intact since the holley has no control over advance.

          Bill,

          I have a Holley Projection 4DI that does have a spark maping capability, with instructions for connecting to a GM 7-wire distributor or, with an adapter, to a Ford 'non-signature' TBI distributor(?).

          I am running a points distributor, with a Pertronix trigger, now. I am open to suggestions on what I should convert to so that I can take advantage of the Holley ECM spark control capability, GM? Ford? or?

          Mickey
          A 4DI........man you are loaded for bear. I think that thing is about 900cfm. what are you running it on???? That is more than I'm using on my 454 motorhome! anyways...
          I haven't played with the 4or 2 DI yet but they are supposed to be interactive(I) with a laptop and their own software. In your situation I would say one of Marks homegrown dizzys would be best. You would need to match up the ESC we are using with the one in the book.(got a scanner?)
          The other option that should work would be the DS conversion hooked to the ESC externally like we are using now for the GM ecm.
          HTH send pics.
          Bill USN-1

          COMMITED TO TEACHING PEOPLE THE "PROPER" WAY TO EFI
          HAMILTON FUEL INJECTION
          May be the answer to all your fuel injection needs!
          Learn to do it right.

          Comment


          • #6
            4DI Projection

            Bill,

            I got one of the 600 cfm Holley 4DI's, and it is fully adjustable via a laptop interface. I have taylored the fuel map to match the requirements to my IHC 392, square bore 4 barrel manifold, mild Comp. cam, Stan's Tri-Ys, dual 2.5 inch exhaust with turbo mufflers, T-19 close, D300, 3.73 D44s (Detroit rear, open front) in my Traveler. I have 4 inch Softriders (spring under) front, stock spring (spring over) rear with a 2 inch body lift. I am trimming the fenders right now for 35 inch tires.

            I loaded a generic map to start, then set idle and max. rpm, and closed loop activation temperature. Then drove it with the laptop engaged and in the monitor mode, noting the readings from the O2 senser at 1000rpm increments up to 5000rpm (rebuilt and balanced engine). Then I used point, click, and drag to adjuct the fuel map so that the mixture is about 10% rich throughout the range, letting the closed loop mode bring it into optimum mixture.
            (Note: Where I currently have the TPS set, it goes Open loop at about 4200 rpm....I feel better having it a little rich up there, since I rarely rev it that high.)

            Even though I am very happy with the Holley, If I had found this site 2 years ago I would have followed your example.

            Mickey

            Comment


            • #7
              open loop

              Something I'm learning more about is just how little you need closed loop.
              Provided everything is properly tweaked, you can actually be more efficient in open loop than closed loop.
              But not without drawbacks. everything seems to be a compromise. It's just what you are willing to compromise. pwr or fuel economy or cold driveability. I think I set my upper BLM to 3600. I'm stock.

              With your DI system you can do about the same thing as I do with these. My main reason for going GM was price.
              I could buy it install it by the support equip(burner/eraser) and learn a lot in the process for less than the holley/howell and many others cost.
              If I depended on my scout every day for work I may have thought twice...maybe.

              I'm mounting 35's right now!!!!!!
              got a set of half used 35X12.5X16's for 50.00 and got a set of Dodge 1500 16X7 rims for 15 each. so for less than 150.00 I got 35's!!!!
              sweet.... :)

              show us a pic!!
              Bill USN-1

              COMMITED TO TEACHING PEOPLE THE "PROPER" WAY TO EFI
              HAMILTON FUEL INJECTION
              May be the answer to all your fuel injection needs!
              Learn to do it right.

              Comment


              • #8
                Bill,

                I think price and learning curve are pretty good reasons for going your route. When you add the advantage of readilly available spare parts, it's not even close.

                I have to assemble a 'spares' kit for the Holley. I have spare filters, but I need to pick up an extra injection pump, spare injector, and an extra tank pump.

                I am running two fuel pumps, a 7psi 'street' pump at the tank, and the Holley 15 psi 'injection' pump up near the engine. Just to see if I could limp home on one pump, I by-passed the injection pump and it ran on just the 7 psi 'street' pump. I didn't do a drivability testing, but I will.

                I have just started on the body, so my Traveler isn't much to look at right now. I will post a picture as soon as I fit the 35's.

                Mickey

                Comment


                • #9
                  holley

                  I did notice a couple things on the holley that I installed for a guy here.
                  It was real sensitive to voltage drops and I could back the fuel press adjustment all the out and it would still run.
                  I was running the 2182 pump tho and I think it puts out a little more press than the stock pump.

                  If you still have the holley injectors you better start looking for a spare now. I heard they discontinued them and are going with a GM style injector.

                  Did you know you can pull the entire holley pod off the TB and with minimum mods can install the GM injector pod???
                  That's what I'm doing right now for my motorhome.

                  well I know it works for the 2 barrel ...but I haven't pulled the 4 barrel apart :( ...yet

                  on my street scout since it is my rolling experiment...I run the stock mech pump on the motor and feed marine mercruiser filter then the 2182 pump. figured the mech pump and filter would help prevent starvation on a low tank of gas!!
                  Bill USN-1

                  COMMITED TO TEACHING PEOPLE THE "PROPER" WAY TO EFI
                  HAMILTON FUEL INJECTION
                  May be the answer to all your fuel injection needs!
                  Learn to do it right.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Bill,

                    I too have heard that the Holley is sensitive to voltage drop so I mounted the battery on the passenger side fender (10 inch feed from the 90 amp alternator), and did a 'home run' from the battery to an ignition switch controlled relay right at the ECU...about 18 inches from the battery. If the Holley ECU sees 'voltage drop' I am sure I am already in big trouble.....

                    Thank you for the two tips, (1) the Holley Injector status and (2) the 2182 pump, I am certain it will be a LOT less expensive than the Holley item. I am going to order a couple Holley injectors. I think I'll hold off before trying to convert to GM injectors, I just want the thing to run for a while now.

                    I went to the two fuel pump arrangement after reading an article by an Arizona Scout/Holley user who was having starvation/vapor lock issues with just the Holley Injection pump sucking and pushing the gas. I figure the Holley Injection pump will last a lot longer, if all it has to do is push......we'll see.


                    Thanks again,
                    Mickey

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by littledog1
                      Bill,

                      I too have heard that the Holley is sensitive to voltage drop so I mounted the battery on the passenger side fender (10 inch feed from the 90 amp alternator), and did a 'home run' from the battery to an ignition switch controlled relay right at the ECU...about 18 inches from the battery. If the Holley ECU sees 'voltage drop' I am sure I am already in big trouble.....

                      Thank you for the two tips, (1) the Holley Injector status and (2) the 2182 pump, I am certain it will be a LOT less expensive than the Holley item. I am going to order a couple Holley injectors. I think I'll hold off before trying to convert to GM injectors, I just want the thing to run for a while now.

                      I went to the two fuel pump arrangement after reading an article by an Arizona Scout/Holley user who was having starvation/vapor lock issues with just the Holley Injection pump sucking and pushing the gas. I figure the Holley Injection pump will last a lot longer, if all it has to do is push......we'll see.


                      Thanks again,
                      Mickey

                      Just watch having it near the engine compartment. I've heard the heat will kill the pumps. that's were mine is for now........

                      I went to the large screw on fuel filter, figuring it would help off road as a surge tank just in case I got low on gas!!

                      The pump is a masters 2182. but it is 75.00
                      some of the guys here were talking about just converting the stock GM tbi pump. You may want to spend some time at the parts store and see what else you can find.
                      That's what I plan to look at next trip to the store.
                      Bill USN-1

                      COMMITED TO TEACHING PEOPLE THE "PROPER" WAY TO EFI
                      HAMILTON FUEL INJECTION
                      May be the answer to all your fuel injection needs!
                      Learn to do it right.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Bill,

                        I mounted the Injection pump on the top of the frame rail where it starts to kick up to clear the front axel. I also fitted a 1/8 inch stainless plate as a heat shield above the frame on the engine/exhaust side of the Injector pump.

                        Holley specifies a fairly large fuel filter between the Injector pump and the TBI. I mounted it next to the TBI as a surge tank/resevour.

                        I have a 'close personal relationship' with an excellent local auto parts supply house, I am going to spend some time looking at the various inline pump options. I'll let you know what I find.

                        Mickey

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I don't think that tank would help as a surge tank, when you lose pressure it is from the pick up in the tank.
                          If the tank is full it probably won't matter but at half tank on hard angles it may?
                          Check out this link to a very cool tank design to solve that problem and use a LOT less high presure line.

                          http://www.sdsefi.com/techsurge.htm

                          [CENTER]1994 Buick RoadMaSSter Estate Wagon LT1/4L60E. White and Woodgrain Sleeper...PCM 16188051 With SS/V4P/Custom Tune! WOT 12.9 AFR!

                          1990 Chevy Suburban Silverado 5.7L 2wd ECM 1227747 HiWay Lean Cruise 18.5 MPG and 12.5 to 1 AFR at WOT!

                          1972 IH 1210 Isky Cammed Balenced 345 4 speed PCM 16197427 Project!

                          [SIZE=3][B][URL="http://www.gearhead-efi.com/"]GearHead-EFI.com[/URL] EFI Conversions and Chip Tuners![/B][/SIZE]
                          [B]May be all you need to know about EFI![/B]

                          and I still help local JustIH members (for fun) free! :cool: [/CENTER]

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Mark,

                            Thank you for the suggestion, and for the link. I really like the idea of optomizing fuel delivery in adverse conditions and this should do it.

                            Previously, I cut a hatch in the top of my 30+ gallon custom (1/4 inch diamond plate bottom) tank just so that I could position the fuel pick up at the fold point, where the bottom of the tank starts to slant upward. As fabricated, the fuel pickup was almost 2 inches off the bottom, which would have been just wasted space.

                            Mickey

                            Comment

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