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  • Who's using WinBin?

    For the 1227747 ECM, the main spark table is labelled "Spark Advance (sub warm bias)". Now does this imply that you need to take the value in the table and subtract the Warm Bias value or that the value in the table already has had the Warm Bias subtracted from it?

    There is another spark table called "Coolant Comp Spk Adv(sub cold bias)". Same question here. What have some of you guys done to this table, if anything?

  • #2
    Re: Who's using WinBin?

    [QUOTE]Originally posted by TORC
    For the 1227747 ECM, the main spark table is labelled "Spark Advance (sub warm bias)". Now does this imply that you need to take the value in the table and subtract the Warm Bias value or that the value in the table already has had the Warm Bias subtracted from it?

    Not sure what ECU file you are using but mine are labeled a little different.(mine-747.ecu) I don't use winbin exclusively , mostly for the switches and constants, but I will try to relate some of what I think I have picked up.

    The spark advance table is the main spark advance. Everything is adjusted from there. The Main spark Bias is subtracted from the spark table to enable negative timing(< 0 or < base timing) Helpful for the WOT runs when it's hot. In winbin the spark bias is not subtracted from the main spark table. I run my spark bias at 10* and my spark timing at 40kpa and 800 rpm is 14.4* in tuner cat.
    In winbin the same setting runs 24.4* If I was just using winbin I would never run this much timing just by looking at the numbers. But the ECM will reduce it by the bias amount.

    There is another spark table called "Coolant Comp Spk Adv(sub cold bias)". Same question here. What have some of you guys done to this table, if anything? [QUOTE]

    I do not adjust this.(yet) If you look the timing is unchanged at 85-95*c so at normal temp it does not affect the timing. It is there to add timing when cold and subtract timing when hot to keep from pinging.
    Last edited by Bill usn-1; 01-08-2003, 08:21 PM.
    Bill USN-1

    COMMITED TO TEACHING PEOPLE THE "PROPER" WAY TO EFI
    HAMILTON FUEL INJECTION
    May be the answer to all your fuel injection needs!
    Learn to do it right.

    Comment


    • #3
      To make sure we're on the same page here. I'm talking about Warm Spark Bias, not Initial (or base) timing.

      I am also using an ECU file called 747.ecu
      Last edited by TORC; 01-09-2003, 06:22 AM.

      Comment


      • #4
        Bill, Todd,

        Is there a way to open the ECM file/program with out using an eprom programmer so I can see what I am in for at the next stage of the game?

        I went thru several sites this morning and put together a list of vehicles that one could acquire all of the necessary sensors. There was several on there that surprised me. I will be going thru this list trying to make it a tad bit shorter, currently 220 some odd pages, map sensor surprised me the most. Almost 114 pages of different engine combos for that alone. My line of thinking is that if you were in a jam and only had a few vehicles to chose from, which one would work?

        Jeff

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        • #5
          Only way I know of to read the image on the chip is to use the programmer. One way to do it is to read the image, make changes, burn and test. Repeat as necessary. Another way to do it is to download a .bin image that is a good starting point, modify, burn and test. Repeat the modify, burn, test steps as necessary. This is an iterative process and the only way to avoid the many multiple burns is to use an emulator. Those go for around $170 +/-. Since there is no existing IH image (except for those created by DIYers), you basically have to tune the engine from scratch. If you are able to get a chip that someone else burned for an IH, it is probably going to be either be somewhat generic or tuned specifically for their application and mostly will require moderate tweaking to dial it in to your engine.

          Oh yeah, since I'm starting with an ECM from a 6 banger, I'm going to start with an image for a 5.7L w/ manual tranny. That's probably as close as I'm going to get to the 5.6L IH with manual.

          Somebody correct me if I'm wrong, but I was under the impression that a MAP sensor was a MAP sensor and they could be interchanged amoungst vehicles as long as you didn't try to put a 2 bar (forced induction) MAP on a 1 bar (noramally aspirated) engine.
          Last edited by TORC; 01-09-2003, 01:14 PM.

          Comment


          • #6
            winbin/tuner cat

            I have found about 4-5 different 747.ecu files the one I am using right now is like I wrote it....747-mine.ecu....... so the titles may be a little different. The base timing is totally different than the spark bias. the spark bias is as stated above. the base timing is what you set your dist at. I set mine at 0* and use the spark table for all the timing values.

            You are right as far as I know that all 1 atmosphere map sensors are the same. The sy/ty--syclone/typhoon will be different since they are turbo or supercharged.

            Now for the chips....you can download the winbin program or the trial version of the tunercat program and look at everything I am talking about. I gave the links to Mark and they are on the main FI page. You(Jeff) may want to get them and start to get familiar with the terminology if you plan on burning your own chips later.
            Tunercat gives you 30 days to look around on their trial copy.
            You can go to the gmecm web site and download the chip program for just about any GM vehicle and see how it is set up.


            saw it listed as (warm) bias. it is the spark bias. From what I can tell the cold bias just reduces the overall spark when it is cold but then adds spark back in with the coolant compensation scale. seems redundant to me.
            Last edited by Bill usn-1; 01-09-2003, 04:15 PM.
            Bill USN-1

            COMMITED TO TEACHING PEOPLE THE "PROPER" WAY TO EFI
            HAMILTON FUEL INJECTION
            May be the answer to all your fuel injection needs!
            Learn to do it right.

            Comment


            • #7
              Bill,

              I'll be checkin out the 30 day free trial version in the morning.

              Thanks,

              Jeff

              Comment


              • #8
                trial copy

                Originally posted by Jeff Eggemeyer
                Bill,

                I'll be checkin out the 30 day free trial version in the morning.

                Thanks,

                Jeff
                forgot to mention the trial copy only lets you edit the 7747 chips.
                ( so what ECM do you want to get?)
                Bill USN-1

                COMMITED TO TEACHING PEOPLE THE "PROPER" WAY TO EFI
                HAMILTON FUEL INJECTION
                May be the answer to all your fuel injection needs!
                Learn to do it right.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Golly gee, Dad, I guess I'll want the........7747??



                  Thanks Bill,

                  Jeff

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Jeff Eggemeyer
                    Golly gee, Dad, I guess I'll want the........7747??



                    Thanks Bill,

                    Jeff
                    you are wise enough to go out into the world grass hopper. Now go...go and find your ECM.
                    Bill USN-1

                    COMMITED TO TEACHING PEOPLE THE "PROPER" WAY TO EFI
                    HAMILTON FUEL INJECTION
                    May be the answer to all your fuel injection needs!
                    Learn to do it right.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Bill,
                      I can't seem to turn up the .ecu file you are using. Anyway you could post it here or email it to me? I'd like to see the differences between it and the .ecu I'm currently using. Thanks.....

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by TORC
                        Bill,
                        I can't seem to turn up the .ecu file you are using. Anyway you could post it here or email it to me? I'd like to see the differences between it and the .ecu I'm currently using. Thanks.....
                        Here ya go it's on incoming FTP site.
                        I'm not sure there is that much different.
                        ftp://ftp.diy-efi.org/incoming/
                        Bill USN-1

                        COMMITED TO TEACHING PEOPLE THE "PROPER" WAY TO EFI
                        HAMILTON FUEL INJECTION
                        May be the answer to all your fuel injection needs!
                        Learn to do it right.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          worth a look-see I guess... thanks for the linky.

                          Whoa!! I spent some time looking through the same .bin file with three different .ecu's. One of them was the original file I was using and the other two I got from that link. The two new ones both have access to a lot more variables!!!!
                          Last edited by TORC; 01-10-2003, 05:42 PM.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Beware of WINBIN

                            Hey guys just to let you know WINBIN has some bugs and deletions in it that can send you astray. I have looked at this because many of you and other customers of mine have tlod me about it. I have fixed some of the bugs in the 7747 .ECU file but the 7730 unit is really off if you are trying to use it. Please do not write and ask for the .ecu file yet, when I have it fixed like I want it I will post it here or where ever for you to download.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Just heard about the reversed scales on one bin.

                              Have you looked at the gmecmedit program yet?
                              looks promising!
                              Bill USN-1

                              COMMITED TO TEACHING PEOPLE THE "PROPER" WAY TO EFI
                              HAMILTON FUEL INJECTION
                              May be the answer to all your fuel injection needs!
                              Learn to do it right.

                              Comment

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